Ask The Slut: Can I Have a Triad, Too?
Filed under: Ask The Slut - June 24, 2008 @ 6:00 am
Dear Slut,
I am contemplating a TRIAD. I am currently married and have a baby boy. I also have a secret lover on the side whom I deeply love and with whom I have a fantastic love life. My wife is not frigid, just not as into sex as I am and does not value it as much (she is almost non-orgasmic and will not masturbate). For her it is more of an job than a way to connect.
We all live in Japan in the same small town (very conservative - think US in the 1950s). I am a round eye and they are not, only important to mention because this is a conservative country and I stick out like a sore thumb. My wife is typical Japanese in many ways, including her lack of desire to reveal her true self to anyone and she does not want to know what is really going on in others. For her, actions are all that counts, not thoughts or feelings and in fact self-denial is seen as the highest good by many Japanese… I fail to feel connected to her as a result.
My lover on the other hand bares her soul to me and I to her. We are connected on a very high spiritual level. I love both women but in different ways. I also feel of course obligated to be a good father and honor my commitments. I want to propose a TRIAD so that we can all have what we want, even it is not the ideal that maybe they had in mind. I am willing to seek legal counsel to draw up some kind of cohabitation contract so that the women all feel protected and secure and that any offspring will be provided for. I am not afraid of commitment. I want to commit. Any advice?
Have Cake, Want to Eat It Too
Dear Sweet Tooth,
I hate to be the one to have to tell you this, but your dream will not come true. I know, I know, it would be sooo cool if all the puzzle pieces fit nicely together and you could have one big happy family and get all your needs met without having to sneak around, but it won’t happen with your setup. Just ask another reader of this blog, a married woman who loves both her husband AND her lover 14 years her junior. Ain’t no way she’s going to live with both happily ever after. She’s going to have to choose one or the other, or scrap both and start fresh.
I’ve been in a triad for a few months now, and I have to say it’s a lot harder than I thought it would be, and that’s with everyone being on board and open about it from the get go, AND with both women being bisexual. Trust me, low libido or not, your wife would feel like shit if she heard you and your lover giggling in the bedroom.
I agree with Tristan Taormino’s (author of Opening Up: A Guide to Creating and Sustaining Open Relationships) take on non-monogamy: it’s harder to introduce the concept into an already established relationship. Most situations like yours end up in one of two ways: carry on the affair until the lover gets tired of the arrangement and moves on, or leave your wife for your lover. It sucks that a thing that makes one person happy can make another person miserable. Or two.
June 24th, 2008 at 7:16 am
So very sorry you didn’t get the answer you so badly wanted.
Boom Shanka
June 24th, 2008 at 7:43 am
I honestly don’t know why so many people are against a little bit of adultery. Besides, lots of my Japanese female friends say they wouldn’t give a hoot if their husband had something on the side, since it would mean they themselves wouldn’t have to put up with sex so often.
June 24th, 2008 at 7:57 am
Did your sex life change after having a child or was it always like this? I cant tell you how many people have told me that their sex lives changed after children. Many people begin to look at each other differently after children, less like sex partners and more like parents. Ive had women tell me that there a large percentage of gals only act interested in sex until they reach the ultimate goal of children, then become frigid. Many of these people go on to have great sex lives with other people later.
June 24th, 2008 at 8:27 am
I have to agree with TBK here though. A little adultery is still adultery and it really seems that you just want to resolve yourself from guilt by including your wife (which isn’t that interested about sex to begin with) with the formation of this triad.
Sometimes in life we just have to choose, I guess.
June 24th, 2008 at 9:50 am
TBK is absolutely correct. First, your wife and lover aren’t bisexual, so what you’d have there is essentially polygamy, not a triad. Second, you’re fooling yourself if you think you can change the deceitful 3-way relationship you have created into a healthy one.
June 24th, 2008 at 9:58 am
I’m the one with a husband and the lover 15 years my junior.
I’ve had to chose between the two. It was a very difficult decision as both mates have such wonderful qualities. But the fact is, while one may be willing the share, the other is completely against it. Chances are, you’ll find that your wife doesn’t want to share - at least not openly.
My husband isn’t very open sexually. We’d go many months without connecting in any way. What it boils down to is that I will not go back to that situation because I will end up cheating again. I can’t put him through that again (he knows about my lover).
My opinion: Keep your lover secret, or leave your wife so she can move on.
June 24th, 2008 at 10:17 am
I hope B-Diddle weighs in on this one, this cheating thing always gets me. I swear, some people are soooo godamn lame, this is why I don’t have children! How about thinking with your brains and not your crotches for a change. You are a notch above a monkey aren’t you? My first step dad cheated on my mom with my at the time 16 year old cousin, what a fucking ape! My SECOND step dad cheated on my mom with his ex wife, what a worthless piece of “human” trash! The selfishness is incredible, you hurt your spouses and worst off your kids, if you have any. I wish you tiny brained cheaters would grow a pair and leave the person your with BEFORE you start cheating! All cheaters have the same lame ass reasons why they do it, my wife cheated on her last boyfriend because she said she was “unhappy” and he didn’t show her affection, boo freakin hooo! Leave the motherfucker if you aren’t happy! B-Diddle is the fucking MAN, he didn’t stick around like a pussy to let happen again.
June 24th, 2008 at 10:41 am
i think a few people are equipped to be monogamous but most are not. life is complicated and sometimes you make choices with what you’ve got. for some people it might make sense to cheat because {if you don’t get caught!}, you don’t hurt your partner and you let off some steam. seems a less hurtful option than to break up an otherwise happy marriage, reject your spouse, hit your finances, split the house up.
check out this article in ny mag about why men have affairs:
http://nymag.com/relationships/sex/47055/
most people condemn cheating until they end up in a similar situation. but they’ll still say it’s wrong. wtf?
June 24th, 2008 at 10:42 am
yeah we’re a notch above monkeys Dor - that would put us at about bonobo ape level
http://songweaver.com/info/bonobos.html
June 24th, 2008 at 11:31 am
Bonobo…a really good band!
June 24th, 2008 at 12:39 pm
Awesome Primate!!! Nice to hear someone with some ape knowledge, we can learn a lot about ourselves by studying apes. The problem with humans is that we’ve gone the way of the chimp when we should have gone the way of the bonobo. Are you familiar with Frans De Waal, his book “Our Inner Ape,” is great. BTW chimps are aggressive, territorial and hierarchical while bonobos are gentle, loving, and erotic. It shouldn’t shock anyone to know that chimp society is very male dominated and bonobo society is female dominated.
Capn Mark, Bonobo is a decent electronic outfit but there are MUCH better out there. Try Boards of Canada’s “Music has the Right to Children”
June 24th, 2008 at 2:24 pm
I certainly never tried to justify my cheating - but I always say, “Walk a mile in my shoes.” I was honest about it to my husband. I told him to my face. It certainly didn’t make him happy to know I cheated, but he was well aware of our problems and didn’t blame me for what I did (I certainly did - but I’ve always been harder on myself than anyone else).
He’s forgiven me for that one lapse. I’ve forgiven him for 13 years of emotional hell. We’re done with the blame. We’ll divorce, but we’ll still love and respect each other and continue to care for each other for the rest of our lives. I’ve been divorced before and I get along with that ex amazingly well, too.
People are human, we make mistakes, we do things while under a cloud of emotional stress and/or mental illnesses that cloud our judgment and override our otherwise moral standings. That doesn’t make us right - it makes us human. Not ape, not animal - HUMAN.
June 24th, 2008 at 2:38 pm
Tara, your situation sounds horrible and I can certainly understand being in a situation where you feel you need to teach the other a lesson or just escape. Most of the cheating I’ve observed however was just folks wanting to get their rocks off with someone different.
For the record, neither chimps nor bonobos are monkeys, they are great apes. Please to not refer to them as monkeys as they are very sensitive about the issue, especially the chimps.
June 24th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
Dor
Based on his comment about legal papers, I’m certain I actually know Sweet Tooth IRL and that he found his way here through me.
I can tell you unequivocally that ST is as far away from Human Garbage as possible, and if it is him is one of the nicest, most kind persons I know.
I have several emails from ST and there is a lot more going on than the post says. In a town where ST is the gringo, ST is truly an alien, so that communion is very important.
But here I am White Knighting a stranger. My point is, there is a lot more to this than just getting one’s rocks off.
June 24th, 2008 at 4:25 pm
I second the point made earlier, that in Japan, culturally, it seems that affairs outside the marriage are much more acceptable. Point of fact, given that he’s a gaijin in a small town, I’d be extremely surprised if people weren’t already aware of his extra relationship. The taboo in Japan would be actually talking about it though. As long as you pretend to ignore it, you don’t upset the “wa” and all is well. Japan’s quirky like that.
June 24th, 2008 at 5:17 pm
Rob, what you described is the US circa 1952, most right wing types would love for us to go back to that time. The wife is at home, she gets smacked once in while, cheated on and its all kept on the down low.
Capn Mark, maybe he is a good person but he’s still whining about what he “wishes” his life was. He needs to buck up and make his life what he wants and save the drama for his mama!
June 24th, 2008 at 5:59 pm
I think, of all the issues that infidelity raises, dishonesty is the one that hurts people the most. But I also think that just not mentioning your discrepancy, ever, is better than trying to assuage your guilt by being “honest.”
People are not naturally monogamous, and there are bound to be libido mismatches in many relationships, or contrasts over what the partners get off on. How does an occasional foray into pleasure that’s unprovided for at home hurt?
If done properly, with dignity and respect, cheating hurts nobody, and can prevent lots of unnecessary relationship break-ups.
June 24th, 2008 at 6:25 pm
I’ve experienced cheating in every way possible, except that I’ve never been cheated on. Why? Because I’ve always “allowed” the men I’m with to fuck other people! Ever since high school. Just about every guy I’ve been with has experienced fabulous new sexual experiences (swinging, orgies, threesomes) And they appreciate that. But they have a hard time allowing me that same freedom to explore and make fantasies come true. This is why I have never had an amazing mfm experience. This annoys me.
June 24th, 2008 at 6:33 pm
Manj, the majority of birds are monogamous, some for life, I think if they can pull it off considering their brain is smaller than a peanut, I don’t think its out of the realm of possibility of humans. If betraying the unconditional love and trust of another human being doesn’t bother you, then I feel sorry for you. Those who question whether or not they can be faithful should avoid monogamous relationships. I would be a fool to even risk ruining the almost 12yr relationship I have with my wife for a little pussy on the side. Of course most men and many women are fools.
June 24th, 2008 at 6:50 pm
Actually Dor that has been disproven. Hardly ANY animals are monogamous, like three species. They did genetic testing on nests of baby birds and found that OFTEN the birds had different daddy DNA. They observed the female birds fucking other males whenever their partner’s back was turned. Where do you think the term CUCKOLDING came from?
http://www.trinity.edu/rnadeau/fys/barash%20on%20monogamy.htm
June 24th, 2008 at 7:10 pm
Tweety, heres a quote from the link you provided
Animals, most likely, can’t help “doing what comes naturally.” But humans can. A strong case can even be made that we are never so human as when we behave contrary to our natural inclinations, those most in tune with our biological impulses.
I said “most” birds are monogamous, some are actually quite promiscuous, owls and doves are known to be monogamous but the grouse is a total slut!
June 24th, 2008 at 7:15 pm
Tweety, heres where the term cuckolding really came from
Cuckold” is derived from the Old French for the Cuckoo bird, “Cocu” with the pejorative suffix -ald. The earliest written use of the Middle English derivation, “cokewold” occurs in 1250. The females of certain varieties of Cuckoo lay their eggs in other bird’s nests, freeing themselves from the need to nurture the eggs to hatching.
June 24th, 2008 at 10:24 pm
I wonder if ST has problems in Japan finding condoms for his gigantic American penis…
June 24th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
Dor-Here is my weigh in…293lbs, as of 11:13pm Central.
The fact that I am single now has provided me another viewpoint on relationships, both long and short term. I am certainly not pursuing a monogamous relationship at the current time, nor do I see myself in one anytime soon.
PS-I must say that I have also learned a lot by watching this triad thing from its inception………..
June 25th, 2008 at 2:35 am
The truth is SOME women would rather keep their man and let them get pussy on the side, rather than have a break-up. This all just depends on the man and the woman. there is no such thing as a rule when it comes to humans.
Humans think, therefore they are random…….
transcendant of typical patterns, constantly doing something different……
and in the end we are just stardust……..
June 25th, 2008 at 3:55 am
Dor, I don’t think the choice is between choosing not to be eternally monogamous and therefore being a weak fool, or being resentfully monogamous forever and noble. That’s simplifying it too much - nothing is EVER that simple (except, perhaps, you).
June 25th, 2008 at 7:01 am
Hmm, I don’t think at any point I said non-monogamy was bad, Im ALL for it. I just think people should be open about it thats all. In fact, very early on my wife and I experimented with being open, at MY request. The first time she made out with a guy she freaked, she could not handle it. We also fooled around with a female friend early on, we just weren’t that into it and it just seemed to complicate things. If my wife were to come to me tomorrow and tell me that she REALLY wanted to fuck some dude, hell I might just be okay with it. But if I find out she’s been fucking some dude behind my back and lying about where she’s been, I’ll fucking walk. To sum up, I think non-monogamy is AWESOME, I think Triads are AWESOME, IF you can make them work for you. Manj, I will refrain from responding to your personal attack with one of my own, just exercising a bit of self control. I am many things but anyone who even knows me casually will tell you, Im anything but simple.
June 25th, 2008 at 5:01 pm
Yes, Dor, but we’re not just talking about triads, are we? You were foaming at the mouth about cheating, a few comments further up the page, calling people who aren’t strictly monogamous “lame” and “worthless” and “selfish” and so on.
Frankly, I think people whose choice is to doom their partner to a life of rare and boring sex - or no sex at all, in the case of some people I know - are to blame for at least part of the resulting conflict.
June 25th, 2008 at 5:27 pm
Manj, this horse has been dead so long its covered with maggots and buzzards are picking its bones. We are all only as doomed as we ALLOW ourselves to be, instead of whining about how choppy the waters are, people should grab the wheel of the boat by both hands and steer it to calmer ones. I invite you to read the comment I left over and over again, the word monogamous is NEVER mentioned. I NEVER said those who aren’t monogamous are bad, simply those who AGREED to be monogamous and have chosen to betray the trust of those they love. I’ve touched a nerve with you because you are a chronic “other woman,” you deserve better. You deserve to be some mans first love, not second.
June 25th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Manj, heres a quote you might recognize
Prejudices - we’ve all got them, whether we want them or not, and challenging them is always a good idea. But I feel slightly compelled to defend my prejudice against some things because, frankly, they’re just not very ideal.
Am I not allowed to be prejudiced against cheaters? Thats the funny thing about prejudice, it feels good to be on the giving end and hell to be on the receiving end.
June 25th, 2008 at 5:52 pm
Dor, do you change your underwear more, or less often than your opinion, depending on who you’re talking to?
June 25th, 2008 at 6:11 pm
Manj, again, I challenge you to point out where I said that non-monogamy among consenting people is wrong. Those on the loosing end of an argument usually resort to shouting or name calling/insults, out of desperation. All you have to do is copy/paste something I wrote that says I believe non-monogamy among those who have agreed to be non-monogamous is bad/wrong.
June 26th, 2008 at 2:50 am
Dor, my dear man, you assume I care enough about you to copy and paste! There’s yet another situation where you’re careering wildly in the wrong direction. But isn’t it funny how you started off name-calling and insulting (re-read your post near the top of the page for some pretty rude ranting from your fine self) and then try to tell me off for it, when the harshest word I used was “simple.”
YAWN!
Already bored.
June 26th, 2008 at 6:08 am
Manj, I did not make any PERSONAL attacks, I called cheaters names, no one here in particular. You’ve cared enough about me to be THE ONLY ONE who continues to respond, Im flattered. I think rather than being bored by me, you find me fascinating.
June 26th, 2008 at 8:39 am
I find all social morons very fascinating, Dor, so in a way, you’re right.
You’re a human car wreck - congratulations!
I’d like to point out (since you seem quite oblivious to the fact) that this is a pretty bad medium for gradually changing your stance - it’s all RIGHT THERE for everybody to read. Seriously, dude. Scroll up. It’s a little hard to manipulate your words once they’re writ.
(I’m also not sure if you’re aware that every post you write sounds like an addition to an already-awkward online dating profile - for a good example see your banana post comments. You seem to be trying to promote yourself as this or that. It’s somewhere between irritating and amusing but I lean towards the amused side - please don’t stop!)
June 26th, 2008 at 9:39 am
Ahh, Manj, you’re back, just as I knew you would be. I am actually someone who feels very fulfilled when others think Im strange or weird. I am pretty fucked up in the head, wouldn’t have it any other way. You should also know that I am quite a shit disturber, I LOVE to stir the pot (and occasionally smoke it).
“The man who never alters his opinion is like standing water and forms reptiles of the mind”
William Blake
June 27th, 2008 at 9:59 pm
At the risk of interrupting the fine sparring between Dor and Manj, I have to drop my opinion here and I agree with Dor. Cheating is cheating. Either you want to be faithful to one person or you don’t. If you have an agreement to an open relationship, then so be it. If you want no legal entanglements and to be free to play with whomever you want that’s fine. If you have a secret lover it’s an affair! I understand why come people feel the need to cheat and I understand how easy it can be to slip into an affair. I’m not passing judgement, one never knows what’s really going on in anyone else’s marriage. It just doesn’t justify it. In the end it destroys the first relationship one way or the other. Even Tara points out that she eventually had to choose. (and I do feel for you, Tara, I was in a bad, albeit extremely short, marriage a long time ago).
June 28th, 2008 at 7:06 pm
Thanks for the empathy Chiavata. I’m not proud of my actions, but I’ve made my bed. What I need to do now is learn from my mistakes - including those that led me to such an unhappy marriage to begin with! Never again!
June 29th, 2008 at 6:40 pm
Thanks Chiavata, its just a sensitive subject for me, my moms life and my childhood were wrecked by that shit. My moms only real crime was continuing to marry, she married three times. She treated ALL of them well, she had a good job, was a great cook and good wife but that wasn’t enough for them. My mom, while probably not a wild woman is FAR from frigid (I’ve heard things, I wish I hadn’t.) Tara’s situation is a bit different from a chronic cheater, she sounds remorseful and seems to have learned from her mistake.