Don’t Worry, He’ll Live Forever
Filed under: Vexed - May 16, 2007 @ 4:50 am
In honor of Jerry Falwell’s death (DID he fall well?) I’d like to point out a Baptist church sign I saw the other day:
We All Live Forever - The Question Is, Where?
So these Christians have cleverly solved that little dilemma we have when it comes to facing death (while also trying to scare you into going to church, hee) - deny it! Our time on earth is only part one. Part two, as mysterious as it is, will carry you on to immortality. Fabulous!
This also solves that other irksome problem we have - you know, destroying the planet? We don’t have to really worry about it. Our time here is just temporary. Huh? Why live life in anticipation of what you hope will happen to you after you die? Why not focus on the here and now, what you know to be the truth, and making it as good as possible?
The NYTimes Book Review on Sunday featured a review of Christopher Hitchens’ book, God is Not Great: How Religions Poison Everything. An excerpt:
The great religions all began at a time when we knew a tiny fraction of what we know today about the origins of Earth and human life. It’s understandable that early humans would develop stories about gods or God to salve their ignorance. But people today have no such excuse. If they continue to believe in the unbelievable, or say they do, they are morons or lunatics or liars.
Seriously, how many stupid atheists do you know?
May 16th, 2007 at 6:51 am
Having being raised as an atheist, I can construct a wonderful argument in that direction. “Religion is the opium of the masses,” said Karl Marx, for instance. That’s what I learned in elementary school, that there is no god and that primitive people invented religion to explain natural phenomena such as thunder. Then, those bad, bad imperialists used religion to encourage poor people to behave and work harder.
But, hm, wait a second… It’s not that simple. Focusing on the here and now is also a religious concept. It’s the Buddhist/Hinduist idea that if you embrace space and time, you achieve unity with the universe. Sex in Asian philosophies is considered one of the routes to unity (see, you’re a goddess but just didn’t know it). And being a vegetarian has roots in the religious principle of non-violence. All in all, I think it’s nearly impossible to separate humanity from religion.
The problem is not in any religion(s); it’s in hypocrisy. Here is what Joseph Campbell says: “Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble.”
May 16th, 2007 at 7:01 am
Do you really have the time and space for me to list all of the stupid atheists that I know?? I think not…
Let’s advocate for anarchy…we only have roughly 80 yrs to live if we’re average and lucky, so just do what you want when you want to whomever you want and don’t worry about any consequencses. Live for today and do whatever feels good for you, you, you…
May 16th, 2007 at 9:24 am
If you were going to bring up Hitchen’s book I thought for sure the excerpt you’d have chosen to add your own personal perspectives to would have been his observations regarding religion’s infatuation/disgust with the birth canal as a “one-way street”.
Regarding Falwell’s demise… Who’s up for petitioning Larry Flynt to stage a massive orgy on his grave?
May 16th, 2007 at 10:03 am
Did I just spy a religious zealot in your comments section?
Just for the record: Atheists have morals, they’re just not based on belief in the supernatural. It is possible to have compassion and be altruistic without the threat of Hell or the dangling carrot of Heaven.
May 16th, 2007 at 2:43 pm
I just finished Hitchens’ book last night. It’s OK but I think The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins is better. I’m not sure these books will actually change any minds, but it seems atheists are being more open and vocal about their unbelief.
Multiple studies have shown the higher one’s intelligence or education level, the less one is likely to be religious or have ‘faith’ of any kind. Among the super-elite in National Academy of Science, only 7% believe in a god.
May 16th, 2007 at 3:30 pm
To TBK:
GREAT post. Very well put. I will have to check out Hitchen’s book.
To Lolita:
Just because certain religions have practices that all of us may partake in does not mean that we are partaking in those religions. Religions came up with customs (good or bad) so that people could be strung along in unity (keep ‘em in line). There were vegetarians before there was buddhism, just as there were non-stealers before there was the ten commandments.
Also, TBK already knew she was a goddess
To rtist933:
The point is NOT to live for today throwing caution to the wind..
The point IS that you should cherish what you have based on what you know. We know we have THIS life and we know of no other. We therefore need to take care of what we have, treating all others with respect because this IS it.
What could be better than treating people, animals, and the earth well for NO other reason than you know in your heart it is right. Noone needs to tell an atheist that, but religions seem to think people need to do good things for god.
Also, studies have shown that atheists and people of all religions do equally well when asked the same questions about moral behaviour. Hmm…
May 16th, 2007 at 4:10 pm
Wow, you guys are real Marxists. I’m in total awe to find such forward thinking in the Midwest. I actually enjoy having atheistic arguments with my mom, because she is a prude and that annoys her.
It’s not that I go to church, believe in heaven/hell, drink holy wine or have sacred orgies with black cats (although mmmm… maybe I should). It’s just that deep in my heart I’ve concluded that there is something bigger than me. And I don’t want to share it with a bunch of fanatics participating in organized religion. That’s all.
May 16th, 2007 at 6:15 pm
rtist, you don’t have to list ALL the stupid atheists that you know, but can you list just five? I’m curious!
May 17th, 2007 at 12:48 am
I take great pleasure in being an animal, actually, and bitterly resent being told I’m not.
May 17th, 2007 at 6:59 am
After coming across & reading TBK’s blog for the past few months, my 1st post has arrived, so please be gentle.
The 2nd part of lotita’s last post hits the nail on the head for me. I do feel there is something bigger than me as well, but don’t think it’s defined by any set of beliefs put forth by a group of old men bent on controlling the masses. So I choose not to align myself with the zealots & hypocrites that makeup organized religion.
Maybe I’ve studied too much history (college major) but I can’t ignore all I’ve learned and am still learning to believe something based on someone else’s word alone, usually with an agenda attached. However, I have no problem with someone’s personal faith, just organized religion. I don’t push my ideals on anyone else, why can’t they do the same?
More importantly, most of the wars in mankind’s history can be traced to the differences between various religions, but we all already know this, right?
May 17th, 2007 at 12:09 pm
Hey Rob,
Did you know that studies have also shown that children who test exremely high on I.Q. tests are also more likely to be vegetarians in their adulthood? The higher the I.Q. the higher the likelihood of being vegetarian.
Go figure
ttfn
May 17th, 2007 at 12:11 pm
As many would consider vegetarianism the height of ethics and morals, one could almost conclude that the higher ones intelligence, the higher the morals….hmmmmm (I won’t quite say it, but I guess I just DID).
May 17th, 2007 at 2:58 pm
Dare I say that I find any belief other than agnostic to be ridiculous?
People decide what they accept as truth based on what makes sense to them. Reality is not shaped by what you think the answer should be or what your brain could grasp. I think humanity understanding whatever the real truth is would be like trying to get earthworms to grasp how electricity works.
Thinking that you understand the universe, beginning, end and reason for being is incredibly arrogant.
May 17th, 2007 at 5:01 pm
Jen,
This is why I leave it up to God the omniscient and omnipresent. Only He knows all the answers.
AMEN.
May 17th, 2007 at 5:36 pm
Jen,
You can dare to say it, but I think you misunderstand what most people mean by atheist. I do not make the claim that I ‘know’ god does not exist, just like I don’t make the claim that I ‘know’ fairies or ghosts don’t exist. I think that the likelihood of god, ghosts, or fairies existing is so remotely small that I do not believe in them.
Bertrand Russell points out that someone could claim that there is a china teapot orbiting mars, and nobody could disprove it. Does that make you an agnostic with respect to this teapot? Technically I guess so, but I feel comfortable denying the existence of this teapot, just like I deny the existence of god.
Who said they understand the universe? I just don’t believe in things for which there is no evidence - like god.
May 18th, 2007 at 8:59 am
TBK-
Since I’m a firm believer of a higher power my general answer to you would be that all atheists are missing a bit of their soul. In my opinion. Doesn’t mean they’re ’stupid’ nor are the majority of spiritual people either. I’ve found that when non-believers make the argument that religion is being forced upon them they are usually speaking of the zealot minority. Most spiritual ppl I know go about their business without shouting.
Extremists on any viewpoint scream the loudest and are viewed as the mainstream voice of their cause. Not neccassarily true in most instances.
And to Durl66, most wars in history were not neccasarily started because of religion. Religion was, however, used as a front for many wars. Most wars in history were fought over territory, politics, or power grabs.
May 18th, 2007 at 9:07 am
monotheist, you’re obviously missing the point. You’re assuming that you know for sure that you’re something more than a little ant, an insignificant speck in the universe that will die and turn to dust and cease to be. If you don’t consider that a distinct possibility, then you don’t really match up to what I described.
Rob, I can say that I am 99.9% sure there is not a teapot orbitting mars. I don’t say that I have any percentage of certainty about afterlifes, spirits, souls, etc. I think there is enough evidence to suggest that the science of our bodies (nerve endings, ears, eyeballs, etc.) limit us to what we can experience and comprehend. Therefore I don’t pretend to have any clue about what exists beyond what I can perceive with my senses. For instance, there’s a book by a Harvard physicist called Warped Passages I want to read. It seems like it’s at least loosely tied to what I’m saying. That there are elements of reality that we don’t experience, but they do exist.
May 18th, 2007 at 11:58 am
Jen,
You make some good points. I was making a point with my silly little comment. No offense intended.
Sounds like an interesting book.